By Roger Nygard.
Every documentarian starts out doing interviews wrong. I learned the hard way, by making all these mistakes.”
Interviews are the main ingredient in the documentary recipe, so how you conduct them is crucial. Everybody starts out doing interviews wrong. I learned the hard way, by making all these mistakes. Once your subjects are in the chair, to get the best results, there are ten rules to keep in mind.
Control the Eyeline
Dialogue has the most impact when the eyeline is as close to the camera lens as possible. But telling subjects to look at the camera and talk can make them feel awkward. A solution is for the interviewer to sit as close to the camera lens as possible. That way, you have a natural conversation while keeping the eyeline close to the lens. For variety, alternate which side of the camera you are on. Avoid interviewing somebody in profile except when you want viewers to feel disconnected. Clear the set of other eyes or questioners. Otherwise, the subject’s eyes will shift around, darting back and forth between you and whoever is behind you, making them look nervous.
While filming Trekkies, we had only one 16mm camera. To get coverage, we had to restage questions, reaction shots, and cutaways after the interview ended. For my documentaries that followed, I used more cameras. Typically, I have three angles: close, medium, and wide. It can be challenging to frame a wide shot that doesn’t see the other cameras, and this angle sometimes works as a side angle. The shots have to be different enough to allow intercutting, to tighten, trim, and re-order material. If I am part of the story, I might use one camera to film myself interacting and asking questions. With multiple cameras, it can be confusing trying to keep eyelines on the same side of all the cameras. I have messed this up more than once. Sometimes, you can get away with “jumping the line,” especially when the room’s geography is clearly established from the start.
After making The Thin Blue Line (1998), Errol Morris (top image, interviewing Steve Bannon in American Dharma, 2018) said he became interested in eye contact. But with the camera off to the side, he felt that interviewee loses a direct visual connection with the viewer. So, Morris designed his “Interrotron,” a mirror system that allows interviewees to look directly into the camera lens while also seeing the interviewer, a kind of “true first person.” Morris said, “the more I used it, somehow the whole environment in which you were shooting disappeared, and just two faces were talking to each other, almost in limbo. It focused it in some strange, magical way.”
Frame a Captivating Shot
The typical way to balance a shot is to position an interviewee in the frame at eye level, to one side of the frame, leaving negative space (open space) in the direction they are looking. Avoid putting them dead center, unless it’s an extreme close-up, or you have an Interrotron, or you want to intentionally try unusual framing or odd angles. If you have wild ideas for odd framing, be daring. A low angle makes the subject seem heroic (though you risk looking up their nose). A high angle diminishes them. An off-kilter angle conveys that the profiled world is eccentric. You don’t have to play it safe. But whatever style you choose, be consistent.
New avenues for interviewing are constantly opening up, such as using footage of a subject in a Zoom app window. A problem with Internet interviews is that a grainy, badly framed image with questionable lighting and sound calls attention to itself. To excuse the inferior quality of video-conferencing footage, the filming process has to be introduced as part of the documentary narrative, where the interviewer might be filmed watching the interviewee on a computer screen. A workaround is to hire a crew on the other end to film the subject while you use video conferencing to be present to conduct the interview.
Shut Up and Listen
Silence is the interviewer’s most powerful tool. After you ask a question, don’t rush to fill in the awkward pause; let the interviewee do it. If you fill the space, it gives them time to second guess their answer and play it safe. Ask a question, and then clamp your mouth shut and wait, no matter what happens..
Liz Garbus recalled times when she was in a cell with an inmate at Angola (Louisiana State Penitentiary) filming The Farm: Angola, USA (1998). “Early on in my films, there was a learning curve for me, to be able to be with characters, in vérité films in particular, or during interviews, and be in silence with them, being open to not knowing where it might go, and allowing myself to go into a journey that may be a little uncomfortable. In an interview, let the silence have its own space and see where things go next.”
Errol Morris said the way he encourages interviewees to open up is by being willing to listen. “You talk to people. You ask questions. Or, if you’re me, avoid asking questions, you accumulate evidence, and you think.” Morris said his interview style began to emerge even before Morris was making films, when he was interviewing mass murderers in Northern California.
Part of my style was to leave the tape recorder running. There was a game I played with myself, to see how infrequently my voice would appear on the recording. … I was most proud of the interviews where I said the least. I was very much interested in the stream-of-consciousness narration, where the person talks and talks and continues talking—much more monologue than interview. Certainly that technique very much influenced Gates of Heaven and Vernon, Florida and everything I did subsequently.”[1]
I try to arrange it so interviewees don’t have anything scheduled afterward so we can keep going if they get on a roll. Expressing one’s point of view to a willing listener is one of life’s greatest joys, and that pleasure is what a good documentarian provides. Listen as though hearing everything for the first time, as the audience will be. Be genuinely interested, and this will motivate your interviewee. It makes them feel good, and they want to repeat that feeling, again and again.
Don’t interrupt. Avoid overtalking or overlapping. Leave room between utterances. Continue to remain silent when they are in the middle of a response, or you suspect something is yet to be said. “And then what?” is a good prompt. Suppress your natural instinct to say “yeah” or “right” or “um hm.” Wait until they are done speaking. This gives you better editorial options than when your voice is all over the audio track. An exception would be if you are also on camera and your responses are part of a natural give-and-take. Conversely, if they are going off on a clearly non-useful tangent, that’s when you interrupt and guide them back to the subject at hand.
Put Interviewees at Ease
Do compliment interviewee responses: “That’s a great answer.” Make them feel good about their contribution: “I love that perspective. That was so insightful.” When they feel like the interview is going well, they relax, lower their guard, and open up.
To make your subjects feel comfortable, say something like, “If you make a mistake or say something wrong, we can take it out.”
Don’t say, “Just be yourself,” or they will start to think about what that means.
Flattery works. Begin by pre-thanking them for taking part, and then compliment them on their work, accomplishments, books, or even the tasteful decor of their office. We like people who compliment us; it’s human nature. You will probably get better material from a subject who likes you.
One technique to help avoid a sea of talking heads is to interview people while doing tasks they would normally be doing (making breakfast, painting, driving, etc.). Create an environment in their natural habitat that allows them to feel loose enough to open up. Sitting in a maze of tripods and lighting stands may take someone out of their normal zone. Once they relax, that’s when the best stuff comes. For variety, interview people in couples or groups. Look for opposing viewpoints and get them to discuss the issue.
Marina Zenovich sometimes reveals something vulnerable about herself, which makes others feel safe to be vulnerable. When she was interviewing Zak Williams about his father for Robin Williams: Come Inside My Mind (2018), she first talked about when her own dad died. “I got super emotional. It’s like you’re trying to light a match within yourself in order to ignite a spark within someone else. And when it’s good and you connect on that emotional level, there’s nothing better.” Zenovich also suggested, “You have to be empathetic, there can’t be any judgment. Treat the interview like a date. Be interested, open, and loving toward the person, wanting them to open up and share their story. Reflect their emotions back to them. I’m always trying to bring out the best in people. I think they can sense that. And so they want to open up.”
D.A. Pennebaker (The War Room, 1993) once told me, “The dumber you seem to your subjects, the harder they try to help make things go right for you. All is lost if you say something too intelligent in front of them.” Nobody likes a smarty pants. Don’t give away your game.
Set the Tone
Your demeanor as the interviewer will guide the result. The energy that you put out is what you will get back. If there’s someone who is quiet and needs leading, bring your energy up until they match it. If that doesn’t work, go ahead and coach them.
Maintain eye contact. Be specific, direct, and deliberate. Your confidence in your questions encourages your subjects to submit to your prompts. Nod, but remain silent. Don’t end a question with “or,” or, “and . . . um.” End cleanly, and then wait. Ask follow-up questions to an interesting answer. Don’t simply read questions.
Sam Pollard (Sammy Davis, Jr.: I’ve Gotta Be Me, 2017) puts his questions on three-by-five cards. He tries to make an interview feel like a relaxed conversation, where subjects are simply expressing themselves. “Most of the time, they give you the information you need during the conversation. If they don’t, I’ll go back and have them give me something more specific.”
Davis Guggenheim (Still: A Michael J. Fox Movie, 2023), avoids chronological, organized interviews. He makes a list of things to cover and leaves it in his pocket. At the end, he opens the paper and usually discovers he’s covered everything, but he did so in a more interesting way than if he had rattled off his questions. Guggenheim said, “The best interviews are after something more elusive, which is energy, flow, and the subject opening up in surprising ways. You want an interviewee to get lost in a great conversation. The worst thought is, Okay, next question. Because if you think, Next question, you’ve interrupted the flow and gone back to zero. The result is that you get an interview like something on a morning show.”
Craft Simple Questions
Ask a concise, single, direct question. Avoid multiple questions or two-part questions, or long, rambling questions with qualifiers. The interviewee will only remember and answer the last part of a multi-part question.
Don’t pre-characterize questions with, “Now I’m going to ask a difficult question.” Or, “Let me ask you something.” Don’t say, “This is a funny question.” You’ve set the bar high and will probably fail to reach it. Ask a question with no pre-qualifiers. Also, don’t start making guesses as to what the answer might be. If you ask, “Why are crime rates in the city dropping?” don’t start offering suggestions: “Is it because of the increase in police funding? Is it because more people are moving to other states? Or . . . .” Shut up and let your subject answer.
A disarming way to phrase a question is to preface it with, “Say more about. . . .” Or, “Talk about. . . .” This is another open-ended way to get interviewees onto a subject. “Talk about what it’s like being a Twins fan.” “Talk about when you were arrested.” “Talk about preparing for the wedding.” “Talk about the best thing about being a lawyer.”
Avoid questions that result in a yes or no. If you ask, “Do you like being a doctor?” You get a “Yes.” Then silence. Instead, give an open-ended prompt. “Talk about what it’s like being in an emergency room.”
Sometimes, you must explain to subjects that they need to include your question in their answer so they will make a complete statement. If you ask, “Why do you like football?” They might launch with a fragment, giving a useless sound bite: “Because it’s so much fun.” What is the “it” in that sentence? If necessary, feed them a beginning for their response, such as: “Start your answer by saying, ‘The reason I like the Vikings is because. . . .’”
Ask what you are curious about—the audience will also be curious. “Why” is the number one word in your toolkit. “Why are you a thoracic surgeon?” An answer goes to the heart of their belief. “Why did you commit this crime?” “Why is your research such a breakthrough?” “Why do you believe you were abducted by aliens?” “Why are you a Trekkie?” “Why are there multiple religions?” Why, why, why!
Start with easy questions about facts to warm them up. “Talk about how many books you have sold.” Move to opinions and feelings later, when they get relaxed. “Talk about how your mother feels about your work.” Bury the controversial question in the middle. While filming The Nature of Existence (2010), I started with questions that have clearer answers, such as, “How old is the Universe?” Cosmologists pretty much agree it’s around 13.787 billion years old. Then, half way through, I would ask matter-of-factly, in the same tone as the innocuous questions, “Is masturbation a sin?” Eventually, you have to get to the big questions. That’s the reason you are there. If you are interviewing a murderer, you have to ask about the murder at some point.
Guide the Responses
Get the sound bites you need. Don’t settle for generalities. If they give a general comment, ask for a specific example or a story to illustrate. If you miss something, tell them to repeat it. If they stumble or are long-winded, have them say it again more concisely. Ask the question again if needed. Sometimes, say, “This is such an important idea, I want to have you cover that point one more time.” I may tell them what I’m looking for, what was missing, or that it was a bit convoluted and we need it more concise. If necessary, I feed them a concise version of the sentence I would like them to say. They will appreciate it. They want to look good.
Find the Emotion
Don’t be afraid of crises and emotions. Rush right into powerful situations. The camera gives you authority; it empowers you to be assertive, and people accept that—they expect it. No apologies are necessary. You are the boss in an interview, and they will obey when your camera is on and you are giving instructions and asking questions.
When I was in Loreto, Italy, touring the Basilica della Santa Casa, I bumped into the Archbishop of Manfredonia. I approached and asked for an impromptu interview. He agreed but became less and less interested as I pressed him with tougher questions about religion. When you have somebody on camera, it’s almost impossible for them to quit. They feel they must keep answering as long as you keep firing questions. Because it was an impromptu interview, the recording space ran out after twenty minutes. During the reload he fled. I was lucky to get what I did. Start every interview with an empty memory card and a full battery.
Journalists often ask about feelings: “How did that make you feel?” Capturing emotions on camera is the money shot. Journalists want people to express motivations, ideas, and feelings in their own words. People are not always qualified to describe some topic accurately, but everybody is qualified to talk about their emotions. “How did you feel when the Challenger space shuttle exploded?” “Talk about how you felt when you were fired.” “Talk about how it made you feel to carry a baby out of that burning house.”
When Marina Zenovich was interviewing Lance Armstrong, she needed to have him talk about his experience with cancer, but it was a story he had told many times. Zenovich worried, “How am I going to get him to tell this as if it’s the first time?” She interviewed Armstrong eight times, and she brought up the subject during one of the earlier interviews.
“Let’s talk about cancer.”
Armstrong replied, “Oh, I don’t want to talk about that right now.”
She hadn’t expected him to stonewall. She was thrown off her plan. She thought, What are we going to talk about? What am I going to do? Armstrong kept looking at his watch. “It was his way of letting me know his time was limited.” Zenovich remembered about another cyclist named Jan Ullrich, a close friend of Armstrong’s, who had been on drugs and nearly died until Armstrong, and others, interceded.
Scrambling for something to talk about, she said, “Talk to me about Jan.” Armstrong wasn’t expecting this subject, and you could see that it took him to a place he didn’t expect to go. He was quiet for a bit and then started talking, and suddenly, his eyes began to tear up.
Something in the moment hadn’t worked, so Zenovich grabbed for another approach, and she touched the core of an undercurrent that Armstrong was trying to suppress: that this could have happened to him. It was the only time Armstrong cried in all the interviews.
“It was this amazing emotional moment that none of us were expecting,” said Zenovich. “And it was beautiful.” She said, when doing interviews, “I’m so genuine and open, almost to the point of being naive. I was thrilled that we hit that emotional moment. I’m always trying to get to that deeper level, which is probably why I love interviewing so much because I love going there. When Lance finally talked about cancer in another interview, it was because we had engaged enough for him to see that I cared and wanted the best out of him. He saw that I had good intentions. And then it was like he was talking about it for the first time.”
End the Interview With a Smile
When concluding the interview, ask, “Is there anything we missed?” Or, “Is there anything you would like to add?” Some of the best quotes come after the interview is over and they suggest something you had not thought of. Thank them, and always say that it was a successful interview, whether it was or not. They don’t know and will be wondering. Make them feel good about taking part. You will need their support later, and this will give them a good feeling about being involved.
Make Friends!
I have learned an immense amount during the making of my documentaries. And I have stayed in touch with many of those interviewed. I have made friends around the world because they felt my genuine interest while I listened, something that rarely happens in our lives. One of the perks of being a documentary filmmaker is that your friend list increases. Imagine spending a few hours with scientists, gurus, athletes, experts, Star Trek fans, UFO enthusiasts, wrestlers, pizza chefs, and many others and asking about their lives. It was particularly satisfying to talk to psychologists, asking them the most challenging questions that were troubling me, and because I had a camera, our sessions were free!
Ken Burns said he has found new friends and mentors on almost every film. For Brooklyn Bridge (1981), it was Lewis Mumford, the social critic. It was the Shaker Eldresses, who were still alive in their nineties, for his film The Shakers: Hands to Work, Hearts to God (1984). He got to know Robert Penn Warren on Huey Long (1985), Shelby Foote in The Civil War (1990), and in Jazz (2001), he said it was Wynton Marsalis, “a mentor who was younger than me. And it’s because we’ve been open to them and their knowledge of the particular subject. And then we keep them. They’re friends for life. There’s something familial about the way we’ve organized ourselves.”
Endnote:
[1] Bilge Ebiri, “Errol Morris on His Early Films, and What He Thinks of The Jinx,” Vulture (March 27, 2015). https://www.vulture.com/2015/03/errol-morris-the-jinx-thin-blue-line.html.
This article is a slightly revised version of Chapter Four, The Documentarian: The Way to a Successful and Creative Professional Life in the Documentary Business by Roger Nygard, Applause Books/Rowman & Littlefield, 2024.
As an award-winning documentarian, Roger Nygard has balanced humor and seriousness in films such as Trekkies and The Nature of Existence. Nygard has also directed TV series such as The Office and The Bernie Mac Show, and edited Emmy-nominated episodes of VEEP and Curb Your Enthusiasm.